SB Nation - Clinton McDonald

Cincinnati Bengals announce the 2009 Practice Squad; welcome back Chris Pressley

Kirkendall — Sun, 06 Sep 2009 18:28:28 -0000

On Sunday afternoon, the Cincinnati Bengals announced the team's practice squad, Tweets Joe Reedy. One of those players is beloved fullback Chris Pressley, who impressed the hell out of fans and coaches for his physicality during Hard Knocks and the preseason. Jason Shirley also returns with the Cincinnati Bengals, who is learning how to play guard and likely Marvin Lewis' newest pet project. After playing sparingly in 2008 as a rookie, Corey Lynch joins the practice squad.

Other practice squad signees are Tight End Darius Hill, Running back James Johnson, Defensive Tackle Clinton McDonald and Linebacker Dan Skuta. Here's the complete list:

FB	Chris Pressley
WR	Maurice Purify
OG	Jason Shirley
TE	Darius Hill
S	Corey Lynch
RB	James Johnson
DT	Clinton McDonald
LB	Dan Skuta

Predicting the Cincinnati Bengals' 53-man roster. A look into the minds of CincyJungle writers

Kirkendall — Sat, 05 Sep 2009 14:05:53 -0000

On Friday, Josh (Kirkendall), Craig (A Pragmatic Bengals Fan), Chris (IFChris) and Jake (jsl413) sat in a room and decided to take on the task filling out the 53-man roster. While initially our intended goal was based on prediction, we also set the roster with players that we think makes the team stronger. For example, our more radical idea that might not be on the mind of the Bengals brass, is to take four running backs, two fullbacks and only two tight ends. We thought that keeping four good running backs and two good full backs would make the team far more stronger than simply adding a third tight end that's currently on the roster; or some tight end that another team released. Even if Dorsey is the fourth running back, he's a strong contributor on special teams. So he makes the team stronger, in our minds. Anyway.

Let's get right to it. Here's our 53-man roster.

Quarterback (3)	Carson Palmer	Defensive End (4)	Antwan Odom
	J.T. O'Sullivan		Robert Geathers
	Jordan Palmer		Michael Johnson
			Jonathan Fanene
Running back (4)	Cedric Benson
	Bernard Scott	Defensive Tackle (4)	Pat Sims
	Brian Leonard		Domata Peko
	DeDe Dorsey		Tank Johnson
			Langston Moore
Fullbacks (2)	Jeremi Johnson
	Fui Vakapuna	Linebackers (7)	Keith Rivers
			Dhani Jones
Tight Ends (2)	Daniel Coats		Rey Maualuga
	Chase Coffman		Rashad Jeanty
			Brandon Johnson
Wide Receiver (6)	Chad Ochocinco		Abdul Hodge
	Laveranues Coles		Darryl Blackstock
	Chris Henry
	Andre Caldwell	Secondary (9)	Johnathan Joseph
	Jerome Simpson		Leon Hall
	Quan Cosby		Chris Crocker
			Chinedum Ndukwe
Offensive Line (9)	Andrew Whitworth		Roy Williams
	Bobbie Williams		Kyries Hebert
	Nate Livings		Tom Nelson
	Kyle Cook		Morgan Trent
	Anthony Collins		David Jones
	Andre Smith
	Scott Kooistra	Special Teams (3)	Shayne Graham
	Jonathan Luigs		Kevin Huber
	Dennis Roland		Brad St. Louis

There's several notable players missing. For example, after some debate, we elected to keep Jason Shirley off the roster, thinking he could be a Marvin Lewis project; which could force him on the practice squad if he clears waivers. In our minds, he's just not ready yet. Marvin White missed the cut; not because of anything he did, but we felt others were surpassing him. However, we shouldn't be surprised if he makes the team. Antonio Chatman's history is too much for a roster spot and a debate broke out between keeping Cosby and Maurice Purify. And we all loved Dan Stuka.

Stay with us all day as we analyze the team's roster cuts as they come through.

Here's a transcript of our entire conversation, or round table, that shows how we came to the conclusion on our 53-man roster.

TRANSCRIPT

Josh Kirkendall: We have 75 players and 53 spots. So by the end of the day, we'll be eliminating 22 players. I know you guys agree that quarterback is relatively easy enough. So let's get to the meat and potatoes of the topic. Running back.
Craig: Wow, diving right in.
Jake: Well running back, to me, is going to be Cedric Benson, Brian Leonard, and Bernard Scott. Just a question of if they keep four. They will want to protect Scott, and they went out and traded for Leonard, so they must see something in him
Craig: I agree with Jake, but not on the order. I think it'll be Benson, Scott, and Leonard. If they keep 4, obviously DeDe Dorsey will stick. Odd man out is James Johnson.
Jake: I honestly think we'll see Scott/Leonard split 2nd string duties. They're both pretty good.
Josh: I agree. I think Cedric and Scott are locks. And Scott and Dorsey have the same skillset. So if the team goes with three running backs, then Dorsey is the odd man out. However, if they go four, then do the Bengals only keep Jeremi Johnson at full back? Many, including the coaches, have high praise with Chris Pressley.
Jake: I don't think they'll risk just keeping Johnson at FB. If they do, they'll definitely put Pressley on the practice squad.
Josh: Last year, the Bengals took three running backs and 2 fullbacks.
Craig: As much as I like Vakapuna's ceiling, you can't let go of a guy who bent a friggin' facemask. Pressley has to stay if at all possible.
Josh: Do you think there's a chance that they keep Johnson and Vakapuna, but put Pressley on the practice squad. In terms of exposure, or notoriety, more people recognize Vakapuna's name more than Pressley's.
Craig: I think Hard Knocks may make it tough to sneak Pressley through to the PS, honestly.
Josh: Good point.

(Chris wakes from his slumber)

Chris: So is Kenny Watson done?
Jake: He was cut a while ago.
Chris: (sigh)
Josh: If the Bengals go four running backs, then who is the fullback?
Chris: Fui
Craig: I think, unfortunate as it is, that JJ is the first FB on the roster. Redeemer and all.
Jake: I think Jeremi Johnson is completely capable as long as he keeps in shape. He had a couple of excellent seasons, remember.
Josh: I agree there. JJ makes the squad as the starting fullback.
Chris: From the limited stuff I've seen, I like what Fui brings.
Josh: Now, if the Bengals take three running backs, who is your backup fullback?
Craig: At this point, I think that Pressley is the second man on the roster. The coaches in the meetings said, point blank, that Pressley is the best blocker.
Josh: You've seen on Hard Knocks how much the coaches play his tough style. Didn't Mike Brown ask what a fullback does?
Chris: Wow
Jake: They love physicality. They want to compete with Baltimore and Pittsburgh.
Craig: That's why I hate Johnson being around. There's no reason to not keep Fui and Pressley around. Jake hits it on the head. Pressley gives them the best chance at pancaking the linebacking corps of the AFC North.
Chris: So who's the starter?
Craig: Johnson.
Chris: Gotcha
Josh: An interesting thought is keeping Johnson and Vakapuna and sneak Pressley through Waivers for the practice squad. How many squads are looking for a FB anyway? He might not be that well known. Though I think Craig is right about Hard Knocks documenting him so much. Damned Hard Knocks.

Josh: I had an interesting thought. What if the Bengals go with four running backs, two fullbacks and only two tight ends? And you know that Coats and Chase make the squad. It's a weakened position anyway and I don't expect signing someone that make us instantly better. Plus the offense has never really utilized the TE position.
Jake: When was the last time they carried only 2 tight ends?
Josh: Actually, they only kept two last year and in 2006.
Craig: That's actually a good though, Josh. I like that.
Jake: Interesting. Well, given how shallow it is, I guess two isn't a bad idea. They can use Andre Smith at a TE in goalline packages.
Craig: They can toss that around, if he ever gets in shape.
Chris: I was going more for fullback for Andre
Jake: No way a 350 pounder can play anywhere but on the line of scrimmage.
Craig: Again...did you see the fat guy waddle he was rocking in last week's Hard Knocks? Dude looked terrrrrible.
Josh: The thought is that you keep the running back and fullback position strong, while keeping TE status quo. The question at this point is who will be available after cut down day that the team could sign that would make the tight ends better. And does Foschi really make your squad better than, say, Dorsey and/or Pressley?
Craig: Absolutely not would be the answer to your question, Josh.
Jake: Does Pressley have the ability to learn TE?
Josh: Like a hybrid?
Jake: Yeah, like Coats. Except better.
Josh: I will make another prediction that Foschi makes the practice squad. Of the things he's shown, he's not bad. Needs some refinement; could he could be a decent third TE in this league.
Chris: I like the two tight ends and it keeps a space in off chance Utecht ever gets healthy. Which is doubtful
Josh: Utecht is out for the year. On IR.
Craig: I doubt we see him ever again.
Chris: Me too
Josh: That could depend on Coats.
Craig: I don't mind Coats, but I don't think anyone sees him as a long term answer to anything? Pressley wouldn't be a bad option as a RB/FB hybrid. How are his hands?
Josh: To be honest, I'm not sure. He didn't have a catch this preseason.
Chris: Coffman is obviously being groomed here.
Chris: Keep in mind, Kelly might be healthy next season too
Josh: I'm not sure he'll be back either. He's UFA after this year
Craig: I look for big things from Coffman, just not this year. Not early, anyway. I wouldn't mind seeing Kelly come back as a coach in some capacity.
Josh: Yea, he's a strong lockerroom presence. The team respects him alot.
Chris: If he still wants to play, I'd sign to a one-year at least
Craig: Absolutely.
Chris: Make him Chase's personal coach
Jake: Chase isn't going be anything like Kelly was though. He's not the blocking type. Although if he developed strength, that's something he could work on this year, that would be a bonus.
Josh: There's a lot of interesting thoughts here. But the question is, what do we do? Do we keep 3RB/2FB/3TE or 4 RB/1FB/3TB or 4RB/2FB/2TE? I like the latter. The 4RB/2FB/2TE.
Chris: The latter
Craig: I say 4/2/2. I think that's the best way to keep the most talent on the squad.
Jake: I'd say 4 2 2
Josh: Sweet.

Josh: So who is the second fullback? I favor Pressley. Though I believe the team will go with Vakapuna.
Craig: I really think its Pressley, which means we'll lose Fui.
Chris: If the staff says Pressley is the better blocker...
Craig: Although, check that; Mike Brown is in the equation. The coaches want Pressley, but I bet dollars to doughnuts that Mike goes with the draft pick.
Josh: I wouldn't doubt that.
Craig: So are we agreed on Vakapuna then, even reluctantly?
Chris: I want the best blocker
Josh: I'm honestly not sure.
Jake: I'd assume we keep the draft pick. Pressley to the practice squad.
Chris: Then yeah, the draft pick
Craig: If he makes it there
Josh: I think I favor Pressley, but I see the team taking Fui.
Chris: Fui is supposed to be a good pass-catcher

(Josh departs momentarily)

Craig: What are your guys' plans for the holiday weekend?
Chris: I cannot wait for tomorrow. College football overdose.
Jake: Party?
Craig: I know! I have a wedding to attend tomorrow, then I'll be at the Canfield Fair all day on Sunday. Performing in a big show Sunday night.
Chris: Yes, absolutely a party
Jake: All my friends are away.
Craig: It's all right, you'll have several college athletes to keep you company!
Chris: Beer and college football. That'll be all the friends we need.

Josh: I believe the top four wide receivers are set: Chad Ochocinco, Laveranues Coles, Chris Henry, and Andre Caldwell. I think the team keeps Jerome Simpson simply because he was the team's second round pick last year. There are four wide receivers competing for that last spot. Now, do you guys believe Simpson makes the squad? If so, then who will be the sixth? I believe Quan Cosby makes it.
Jake: I think Simpson definitely makes it. He's flashed some skills.
Craig: It's down to Purify or Cosby for me if Simpson stays; which I think he does also.
Jake: I didn't see enough of the game last night to make the call if Cosby makes it
Craig: Cosby didn't do much if anything last night, but neither did Purify; if I recall correctly, anyway. Again, I missed the first half.
Chris: Simpson stays.
Josh: What about Antonio Chatman? He could be a Marvin Lewis favorite, making the squad by default. Purify's only advantage is that he has more receptions than Cosby. Cosby has none on offense, by the way.
Jake: How could Chatman possibly make it at this point?
Craig: Man. Forgot about Chatman, completely.
Josh: I don't see it either.
Craig: I think I agree. Chatman has to be out.
Jake: I mean, I guess I see that he's Marvin’s boy, but man, please, no.
Josh: Then you have Freddie Brown.
Chris: He can't stay over Cosby or Purify? Or won't I guess
Craig: Ocho, Coles, Henry, Caldwell, Simpson, Purify for Craig. Tom Nelson makes Cosby expendable/PS candidate.
Josh: They could justify that Chatman, when healthy, is the better receiver on offense. And to be honest, I would agree. However, the durability issue makes it impossible for me to keep.
Craig: I don't see Chatman outplaying Purify at this point. Not even close. Although, when healthy, yeah. I suppose.
Chris: Ocho, Coles, Henry, Simpson, Caldwell, Chatman
Josh: Wow. We're totally split on this one. I predict Cosby, only because of his punt return potential. Chris has Chatman, Craig has Purify and Jake just hates Chatman.
Chris: I have Chatman because he's Marvin's boy and has experience with the team.
Jake: I don't like any of the options at number six.
Josh: I honestly can see that, Chris.
Craig: I'd like to see Cosby stick, I really would. Maybe they practice squad Purify again if Chatman doesn't stick.
Jake: He hasn't played or practiced. No way Chatman makes it
Chris: Yeah, that's true too. If not Chatman, Cosby. But Purify is damn physical for his size.
Jake: Cosby has some good special teams utility, but I don't think he has enough to stick. Bernard Scott looked great in that kick return.
Craig: I just hate to see them maybe lose Purify. The guy's a beast physically.
Chris: That's true. More so than Cosby
Josh: So it's between Cosby and Purify. Let's take a vote.
Chris: I'm changing my vote again
Craig: He made Roy Williams look like a fool in the Oklahoma.
Chris: Damn persuasive up in here
Josh: That was embarrassing as hell for Roy.
Craig: That said, first punt return for touchdown in, what, five years?
Josh: Who was also trying to cop out of the drills with Coles.
Jake: Purify is my vote.
Chris: I voted for Cosby for punt return. But the Scott point made perfect sense.
Craig: I'm so glad I'm not making this decision for the team! Don't forget Tom Nelson's 44-yard return last week either.
Josh: Alright, Purify?
Craig: The more they're going to want to use Scott in the offense the less they're going to use him in the return game, remember.
Josh: Good point, Craig.
Chris: I hate that concept
Josh: I think Scott would be kickoff return anyway, not punt return.
Jake: If they keep four running backs, Scott won't get much playing time. We think they keep 4 RB, so Scott can return kicks and play on some third downs.
Josh: Dorsey could too.
Craig: Ah! Okay. Ocho. Coles. Henry. Caldwell. Simpson. Cosby. That's my final answer.
Josh: But the issue is punt return; Scott hasn't returned a punt yet. Cosby, in the preseason, returned seven punts and Nelson got six.
Craig: Purify to the practice squad for the second year running.
Chris: I’m back on Cosby again
Josh: OK, time for final vote.
Chris: Cosby
Craig: Cosby
Jake: I think Cosby will make it. Sorry. I want Purify.
Josh: I can see why. You're right. He is a beast.
Craig: I'd be okay with Cosby, really. We have enough talent on offense that I think the 6th WR has to contribute in other ways anyway, so Cosby is the better call the more I think about it.
Josh: I just think that Cosby brings more immediate contributions. Purify isn't a returner and I highly doubt he gets any playing time with Chad, Coles, Henry and Caldwell in front.

Josh: In 2006 and 2008, the Bengals took nine offensive linemen. In 2007, they kept eight. We can assume they're keeping Andre Whitworth, Bobbie Williams, Kyle Cook, Nate Livings, Anthony Collins, Andre Smith, Jonathan Luigs and Scott Kooistra. So we're left with one spot left.
Jake: Jason Shirley
Josh: OK, there's two thoughts here. We could go with eight and be done.
Craig: Well, if we do keep nine including Shirley or someone else, which position is left to suffer?
Josh: The issue with a ninth is that we could be cutting into the defensive roster -- which might not be a bad idea because they seem like the stronger of the two units.
Chris: Or keep eight and keep Purify. But yeah, I see the point about not hurting the defense as bad
Josh: And I disagree with Shirley. While he's literally throwing guys when blocking, I just don't think he's ready to make the roster. He's the typical Marvin Lewis project guy. I think he's still eligible for the practice squad. I think Dennis Roland has a better shot.
Chris: "literally throwing guys when blocking" Is a hard talent to ignore, even if he is a little raw.
Craig: Shirley should be eligible for the practice squad, but I'd bet good money that we'd lose him in the process, especially with him being such a mauler at guard.
Josh: I agree, Chris. That's why I think they'll hope he clears waivers. It wasn't so long ago that Marvin Lewis said flatly on Hard Knocks that Shirley's last chance to make the squad at all was to convert to the offense. In reality, the question is do you want to keep a fourth guard, or a fourth tackle.
Craig: Fourth tackle, for my money. How are we looking at Andre Smith in this equation? Are we actually talking about a fifth tackle?
Josh: That's why I think Roland's the better choice right now. Think of it this way. If Smith doesn't return soon, and god forbid, Whitworth or Collins goes down, we're out of tackles.
Chris: I need a beer
Josh: Sure, Kooistra can play the position, but he's been working mostly guard too.
Craig: I agree with you, Josh. Roland is the smart choice here.
Josh: For now at least. If Shirley passes waivers and I believe he will, and then he's signed to the practice squad, that would be the best scenario for him.
Craig: I'm cool with that. I might be overestimating, but I do worry that he won't clear waivers.
Josh: We also have Evan Mathis and Andrew Crummey. Think those two have a shot?
Craig: I'd say Mathis more than Crummey.
Josh: Alright, full vote. Between Roland and Shirley.
Chris: Roland
Craig: 2. Reluctantly.
Jake: Humph. Roland, I guess. I'd like Shirley.
Josh: I think we all would, to be honest.
Chris: Yep. Tackle will win out, however
Josh: Alright. The offense is set. SWEET!

Craig: Sidebar: Any kind of wishing we could keep Swank?
Josh: He proved that franchising Graham was kind of redonkulous. I love that word.
Jake: Swank hasn't been that impressive. But he made what Josh said true
Craig: Makes me think of Koothrapali in Big Bang Theory.

Josh: Now, historically, the Bengals have taken eight defensive linemen. Mostly it's four defensive ends and four defensive tackles. Here's what I think are locks; Antwan Odom, Robert Geathers, Michael Johnson, Pat Sims, Tank Johnson and Domata Peko. That leaves two guys.
Craig: Rucker should be in the equation probably.
Josh: Well, you got Fanene and Rucker at defensive end. Harrington too.
Craig: Right, Fanene and Harrington the tight end.
Josh: Then you have Clinton McDonald, Langston Moore and Vernell Jenkins at DT.
Chris: I'm voting Jenkins. And you all already know that
Josh: A little UK love?
Jake: Moore's gotta make it.
Craig: Moore is a good pick too.
Chris: Absolutely
Craig: So we really need one end and one tackle. Rucker and Moore?
Josh: I think Moore is the more likely pick. Does that leave McDonald on the practice squad? As for Rucker, I think Fanene beats him out. And the only reason I say that is Rucker's durability. He has none.
Chris: True
Craig: Yeah, you're right. For some reason I always forget about Fanene.
Jake: Might be hard to deny Rucker a spot though, he has quite a bit of talent and has played well.
Craig: He's one of those guys that's just solid and makes plays.
Josh: In three seasons, Rucker has only played 16 games.
Chris: Sterling
Craig: Ouch.
Josh: I like Rucker too. I mean, the dude will catch on with easily another team.
Chris: And be healthy
Craig: And be a perennial All-Pro and eventual HoF inductee.
Chris: You got it
Josh: Cincinnati karma.
Jake: Fanene has been pretty solid though when he gets playing time.
Craig: I like Fanene for his DE/DT versatility. Similar to Bryan Robinson in that regard.
Josh: Fanene has only missed two games in the past two seasons, though he hasn't been flashy. I like his versatility too.
Craig: I think this team is at the point where they need to (at least on the defensive side of the ball) put guys in place who make plays, not guys who might make plays. This defensive unit is CLOSE.
So for his solid play and durability/versatility, my vote goes to Fanene I think.
Josh: I agree. And if Rucker stays healthy, he fits that bill. But you have to depend on the guy too.
Craig: Right. That was my primary point.
Josh: On the other hand, Harrington has two sacks this preseason.
Craig: Yeah. Crap.
Chris: That's big
Josh: Decisions, decisions, decisions.
Craig: What string was he playing against?
Josh: Not much against the first team. Not really sure if he had many first half snaps.
Craig: So that's in the equation too, kind of, sorta.
Josh: Agreed. So the question between Rucker and Fanene is health. Harrington, if he passes waivers, can be ~~the team's starting tight end and~~ join the practice squad.
Craig: So Rucker=out. Another third round pick down the tubes (3rd?). Guys? Fanene or Harrington? All considered I think it has to be Fanene.
Josh : I'm picking Fanene, only because of the question about Rucker's health.
Chris: Didn't we establish Mike Brown likes draft picks?
Craig: lol @ the TE comment. That'll never get old.
Josh: I've cried every night in my sleep after that.
Craig: So we agree that WE want Fanene. Thoughts on what will actually happen?
Josh: I actually think it'll be Fanene. He's on his second contract right now anyway. So you know the team likes him, and Jake is right, Fanene is solid.
Craig: I'm good with that, Josh.
Jake: I think Fanene will stick.
Josh : So we went with Langston Moore and Jonathan Fanene.

Josh: In respect to linebackers, the Bengals took eight in 2006, seven in 2007, and six in 2008. The locks, I think, are Keith Rivers, Dhani Jones, Rey Maualuga, Rashad Jeanty and Brandon Johnson.
Craig: Yep.
Josh: I really liked Hodge during preseason and he's a special teams contributor. I think he backs up Dhani.
Jake: Hodge absolutely sticks. Simmons will be sure of it.
Craig: Right.
Chris: That's six.
Craig: So. Maxwell? In or out?
Jake: I dunno about Maxwell.
Josh: I think Blackstock makes it, if for any reason, he can play defensive end also.
Craig: I was going to say I think Blackstock sticks. His career-ending hit on Utecht has to count for something other than wasting another of my Bengals jerseys.
Josh: Then you have Dan Stuka.
Chris: I vote for him on name alone. That's just a badass name
Craig: We need to bring back Bjork.
Jake: Reminds me too much of Ditka
Josh: There's another issue we need to consider. Do we just keep six backers and 10 in the secondary? Or seven backers and 9 in the secondary.
Craig: Got to be 7 and 9, I think.
Chris: "What's your name, punk?" "Dan STUKA." "Oh, damn. Don't mess w/that guy." "Damn right.
Chris: I'm sorry
Josh: It's a sweet football name. Then the seventh linebacker has to be Blackstock.
Craig: Absolutely. Blackstock at #7 backer.
Chris: Yes, Blackstock
Josh: Alright, we'll go with Blackstock.

Craig: So we're on to the secondary then?
Josh : Now this will be the toughest one of the night -- and the last.
Craig: Josh, locks?
Chris: (whispers) Dan Stuka will be watching us. Remember that.
Josh: I got Johnathan Joseph, Leon Hall, Chris Crocker, Chinedum Ndukwe and Roy Williams. Now, I think Tom Nelson is a close lock -- like most everyone else, I loved his play.
Craig: Hall, Joseph, Jones, Crocker, Ndukwe, Williams, Nelson would be my locks. Personally.
Josh: I agree, so Nelson makes the team?
Chris: Who's that kid that made that huge sack against the Pats?
Craig: I don't see how he can't make the team. The guy's a beast.
Josh: Chris likes Nelson too.
Chris: Yeah, him
Craig: Nelson brings versatility as I think he could be a nickel corner also.
Chris: He's certainly got the speed for nickel
Josh: I question David Jones. Is the talent in the secondary deep enough? Is Jones worth keeping, though he didn't make any preseason games?
Craig: It depends on how confident they are with either trying Nelson there or Geoff Pope.
Josh: No thanks on Pope.
Craig: Just sayin'.
Josh: Kyries Hebert is another I like that doesn't much notice, because his strength is his special teams play.
Craig: I'm glad Fletcher is already gone so we don't have to factor him in.
Josh: No doubt
Craig: Yeah, Hebert's got to stay. Led in teams tackles last year, didn't he?
Josh: Yea. We're up to seven. What about Morgan Trent? We need to start looking at cornerbacks. We've listed five safeties already.
Craig: Okay. I think Trent sticks.
Josh: Trent makes the team. You agree?
Chris: Absolutely. Haven't seen much, but what I've read.
Josh : He hasn't been bad.
Craig: So one more. Lynch? That's another safety so maybe Lynch goes.
Josh: I don't know. This is where I think David Jones squeezes in.
Craig: Yeah, more than likely.
Josh: You could also go Pope or Rico Murray.
Craig: Jones improved over last season. No. Jones is better than either of them. Practice squad Pope again, he may be ready next year.
Josh: Jones was placed on the depth chart as the third CB at the start of training camp. Do we reluctantly agree with Jones, or do you guys think we should go with six safeties and keep Lynch?
Craig: That probably depends on Nelson's cover skills.
Chris: Three cornerbacks?
Craig: I wouldn't mind keeping Lynch around, but we definitely need another corner.
Josh: What about Marvin White. We're completely excluding him.
Craig: I'm getting a headache.
Josh: We could swap out Hebert for White.
Craig: Crap, I didn't even realize that White wasn't on our list. I think that says enough about him, though. I think White goes.
Josh: Axe White?
Craig: How do you keep him over your number one special teams guy?
Josh: I'm just not sure where he'd fit in. It would be a numbers game. On the other hand, would the Bengals elect to keep White over Nelson?
Craig: A couple of years ago our special teams squad was decimated and it took over a year to shore it back up. I don't want to see that happen again.
Chris: Better not
Craig: White/Nelson. That's actually probably the best battle happening right now on defense.
Josh: Or, we could dump a running back for another guy in the secondary.
Craig: Dump Dorsey if we want to go that route.
Josh: Dump the oft-injured Dorsey for White. Now we're getting interesting.
Craig: For me? No question. None at all.
Chris: See ya
Craig: What will Mike Brown do, though?
Josh: Exactly.
Chris: Suck. That's what he'll do
Josh: I can see that.
Craig: Son of a gun. I'm stressing about this like we have any say in the matter right now, rubbing my temples and such.
Josh: LOL. We're on the last roster spot. Here's something else to consider. Dating back to 2006, the Bengals have always taken ten or more defensive backs.
Chris: STUKA. Sorry
Craig: So we're short unless we knock off Dorsey, which throws us back into the Dorsey/Leonard discussion. I really wish he hadn't have blocked/returned that punt.
Josh: In regards to Dorsey, I'm not sure if we should use a spot on him for blocking a punt. While it's nice, it's never a certainty. And with Dorsey's skillset, we have Scott.
Craig: I know that. You know that. Bratkowski talked on this week's Hard Knocks about him blocking the field goal two years ago.
Josh: Yea, it just goes to show how fickle the coaches are on the competition.
Craig: Right. I mean, I like a punt block and touchdown as much as the next guy, but...
Josh: On another note, think about it this time last year. You know who we were discussing? Perry, Watson, Dorsey. So you're starting to favor cutting Dorsey for a 10th defensive back?
Craig: Wow. What a difference a year makes. Yes. Yes, I am. Dorsey goes, White stays for me.
Chris: I don't see them dumping a four-year player for a 10th defensive back. Just sayin'
Josh: I think it's a valid point. Do you get rid of Dorsey, who played redonkulous this preseason, for sheer numbers in the secondary? Instead of White, we could keep Lynch. Or we could keep Pope However, here's another point. How much playing time do we really expect Dorsey to get with Cedric, Scott and Leonard in front of him.
Chris: What if Cedric goes back to sucking?
Craig: Dorsey is just going to get hurt. Again.
Chris: Maybe more than it would first seem.
Craig: Chris, that's when Scott takes over.
Chris: Every down?
Craig: Leonard will share. I'm not worried about Cedric, though.
Chris: I am.
Josh: Honestly, if Benson goes down, then I think Leonard becomes the feature back and then Dorsey would be the team's third-down back. And if Benson sucks, then Palmer throws for 5,000 yards and 50 touchdowns. No problem.
Chris: Over Scott? Leonard.
Josh: I think Leonard has the build and style to be a feature back. Scott needs to be that change of pace guy. I would be surprised if he ever gets 15 carries this year.
Craig: LT, Josh?
Josh: You're comparing Scott to LT?
Craig: No. Just sayin'.
Chris: He's got mad skill
Josh: Hey, who knows what happens. I just don't think takes over a feature back role this year.
Craig: Okay. Does DeDe stay or go?
Chris: Stay.

Josh: Here's where we are. We have 52 players set now. We have only 9 defensive backs. The Bengals have historically taken 10 or more. We're thinking of freeing up a spot to give us a 10th, and we instinctively went right to DeDe.
Jake: I have company.
Craig: Nice.
Chris: Pics?
Josh: iPhone?

Josh: We're so close! One more... we... can... do... it... We just need to make a decision. Do we take someone out in favor of a 10th defensive back?
Craig: Okay. DeDe is long past practice squad-eligible, right? Not that it would matter, someone would snatch him up like the Colts did anyway.
Josh: You guys know that the Bengals coaches are right now talking about this.
Chris: I'm keeping Dorsey.

Langston Moore signing is likely a numbers thing; ESPN features Bengals (joy); nervous about Carson Palmer?

Kirkendall — Tue, 25 Aug 2009 11:00:23 -0000

+ One of our newest residents Jake wrote on Monday that the Bengals signed former 2003 Draft Pick, Langston Moore. What does this mean for the team's depth chart? Most likely nothing. But we have a relatively fair guess. Before the signing, the Bengals had five defensive tackles on roster: Domata Peko, Pat Sims, Tank Johnson, Clinton McDonald and Pernell Phillips (note: McDonald is actually listed as a defensive end on Bengals.com, but as a defensive tackle on the depth chart).

Phillips hasn't taken a preseason snap yet and he's likely going to miss the game Thursday. It wouldn't make sense to play Sims, Peko and Tank through the entire meaningless preseason game, which leaves McDonald. So the Bengals signed Moore to fill in during the latter stages of the preseason game in an effort to conserve the main rotation guys. Of course, it's just a guess. But a fair guess, we think.

Reader firstPick asked John Thornton about the move, to which Thornton said, "Good move. He's a good inside rusher. I hope he gets a shot 2 stick. I hated to see him cut 3yrs ago." Makes sense. If Phillips can't play during the preseason, then why not hold onto Moore if he performs and make Phillips a practice squad candidate?

+ ESPN's Elizabeth Merrill details the Bengals disaster since Mike Brown became the team's owner in the early 90s. Brown is quoted in the piece as saying, "Do I think we will be perpetually down? I do not. I've seen every team in this league when it was down. And the lesson from that is you can come back and fly high." The problem with this is that the Bengals haven't flown anywhere after being down. Consider that from 1991 to 2000, the Bengals achieved .500 one time (1996). During that same time-frame, they've won five games or less in seven of ten seasons. In the nine seasons since, the Bengals achieved .500 four times, winning five games or less in only three seasons. Am I really saying anything we haven't said before?

+ Carson Palmer didn't practice on Monday, the third straight day, and is doubtful to take the field on Thursday against the Rams. The issue:

"I can throw, but not drop back right now," he said. "I'm trying to keep my arm in shape, basically. I'll take it day-to-day."

While there's no report that indicates anyone should be worried, forgive me for being worried. We know what happens when Palmer doesn't play. The training staff hasn't been noted as exactly being the front runners of player recovery in the league. Secondly, Palmer is hurt. I'm freaking out right now.

More, more, more.

Former Bengals safety Kevin Kaesviharn signed with the Carolina Panthers on Monday.

Backup guard Evan Mathis is taking snaps place of Jonathan Luigs, who hasn't practiced at all this week.

Bengals offensive coordinator likes what he sees with Jason Shirley's conversion to the offensive line:

"It's going pretty good," he said. He added Shirley had a pancake block against the Pats, but Bratkowski also said, "I'm not sure he's quite ready to play in the regular season, but he shows potential."

Players likely out this week against the Rams:

Shayne Graham (groin), defensive tackle Pernell Phillips (leg), tight end Matt Sherry (shoulder), defensive end Antwan Odom (Achilles), wide receiver Antonio Chatman (ankle), cornerback David Jones (foot), and tight end Ben Utecht (concussion).

Who Dey Fans is right. Peter King mentions the Bengals. And doesn't talk about us like the terrorists of the NFL. That's progress, right?

Marvin Lewis received the "Steve Patterson Award for Excellence in Sports Philanthropy, in recognition of the impact of his work and the example it sets for all of professional sports."

Running back Brian Leonard is looking forward to this week's game against this old team.

Levi Jones' name is being thrown around in Seattle.

The offseason boxing regiment that Chad Ochocinco Johnson used to train, has him confident enough to call out Andre Berto.

The Washington Post's The League, asked me if I were Chancellor Roger Goodell, what policy on Twitter would I implement? I didn't make one thing clear. If Twitter updates are made about the person that hasn't anything to do with the team, league or other players that could possibly give another team a competitive advantage, then that's cool.

For your get to know your opponent file. Five things to know | Camp Tour

Bengals Release their 2009 Depth Chart for Training Camp

Kirkendall — Tue, 28 Jul 2009 18:24:30 -0000

On Tuesday, Bengals.com published the team's 2009 Depth Chart -- which is likely to change from now until meeting, and destroying, the Denver Broncos in September. Any surprises? J.T. O'Sullivan is the team's starting quarterback. Kidding. Kidding.

Kenny Watson is listed as the backup running back with Brian Leonard on third-team and Bernard Scott on the honorable "Other" column. Fui Vakapuna starts over J.D Runnels as the team's feature fullback while Jeremi Johnson is listed third on the chart and Chris Pressley a distant fourth. No real surprises at wide receiver with Chad Johnson and Laveranues Coles starting. Chris Henry and Andre Caldwell are the team's first backups. Andre Smith is listed as the starting right tackle (which is expected, but could change). Chase Coffman is listed under "Other", behind Reggie Kelly, Ben Utecht and Daniel Coats, who is apparently moving back to tight end.

Defensively, the team lists their safeties as Roy Williams (strong) and Chris Crocker (free) -- acquisitions picked up dating back to the middle of last season. Chinedum Ndukwe and Marvin White, two of the team's 2007 draft picks, are the primary backups. Rashad Jeanty is listed over Rey Maualuga (which we expected) and Domata Peko and Pat Sims start at tackle. Jason Shirley and Tank Johnson are rotating in as backups and rookie Clinton McDonald is listed as a third-teamer. Michael Johnson, another rookie, is listed as the team's third-string defensive end behind Frostee Rucker.

Not many surprises. Most of what happens during Training Camp will shift everything around; so there's really little stock on the depth chart -- other than further confirming that football season is near!

Charting Contracts for the Bengals 2009 Rookie Class

Kirkendall — Sat, 27 Jun 2009 21:00:18 -0000

As we wrote in a preview post, the Bengals tend to sign a majority of their picks in the week leading up to training camp. However, sometimes they do things differently. Like signing four of their 11 draft picks in June. The following is a chart that we'll (hopefully) update when the team signs their rookies.

Pick	Round	Rookie	Position	Years	Base	Signing	Total
1	1	Andre Smith	OT
2	2	Rey Maualuga	LB	Four		$2.84 M	$4.66 M
3	3	Michael Johnson	DE	Four	$1.75 M	$863,020	$2.613 M*
4	3	Chase Coffman	TE	Four	$1.75 M	$622,000	$2.372 M
5	4	Jonathan Luigs	C	Four	$1.75 M	$509,000	$2.259 M
6	5	Kevin Huber	P	Four	$1.75 M	$195,000	$.1.945 M
7	6	Morgan Trent	DB	Four	$1.75 M	$112,000	$1.862 M
8	6	Bernard Scott	RB	Four	$1.75 M	$77,500	$1.828 M
9	7	Fui Vakapuna	FB	Four	$1.75 M	$61,000	$1.811 M
10	7	Clinton McDonald	DT	Four	$1.75 M	$39,000	$1.789 M
11	7	Freddie Brown	WR	Four	$1.75 M	$37,588	$1.787 M

Dates of Signings:

June 16: Morgan Trent
June 18: Freddie Brown
June 20: Bernard Scott
June 22: Clinton McDonald
July 7: Fui Vakapuna
July 16: Kevin Huber
July 20: Jonathan Luigs
July 27: Chase Coffman
July 28: Rey Maualuga
July 28: Michael Johnson

* Deal is includes a fourth-year escalator clause that, if triggered, could reach a maximum value of $3.47 million.

Bengals sign seventh-round draft pick, Defensive Tackle Clinton McDonald; four down, seven to go

Kirkendall — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 01:03:39 -0000

When the Bengals signed Tank Johnson, it meant the end for John Thornton's career in Cincinnati. It also meant that Orien Harris went to fourth or fifth on the team's defensive tackle depth chart -- depending of course how you view Jason Shirley. Oh, the Bengals weren't done. With their tenth pick on Sunday, the middle of three seventh round draft picks, the Cincinnati Bengals drafted Memphis defensive tackle Clinton McDonald. Since the Bengals had a core of defensive tackles in Tank Johnson, Domata Peko, Pat Sims and Shirley, the likelihood of keeping Harris over any of those guys was incredibly small. The option, release Harris.

Or trade him for a running back in Brian Leonard, who was selected second in the 2007 NFL Draft. Shocking. The fact that the Bengals were able to trade for someone that we're likely to use in 2009 for a guy that they were all but sure to release, is, well, you have to admit, it's kind of impressive.

Then on Monday, the Bengals reportedly signed McDonald, giving the Bengals their fourth draft picks signed. Seven to go. When terms are released and known, we'll pass that to you.

Bengals sign CB Morgan Trent - Four Years, $1.85 million and $112,000 signing bonus. Bengals sign WR Freddie Brown - Four Years, $1.189 million and (approx.) $37,500 signing bonus. Bengals sign RB Bernard Scott.

Speculating on Kicker Ryan Succop's Bonus

Chris Thorman — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 01:15:13 -0000

View full size photo »

Now before I go on, I have to mention this is hardcore fandom stuff here. Examining the possible signing bonus money for Mr. Irrelevant, who happens to be a kicker as well? That's what we do here. Obsess over every possible Chief related detail that these here Internets provide for us.

Anyway, it's been reported that Succop's contract is worth somewhere in the $1.2 million dollar range, over three years. How about that signing bonus though? That's guaranteed you know. There's big time bonus bucks for the last pick in the draft.

Here are some of the salaries already agreed to by picks close to where Succop was drafted, courtesy of Mac's Football blog:

245. Seattle (comp) - S, Courtney Greene, Rutgers - Signed (4-years, terms undisclosed)
246. Chicago (comp) - G, Lance Louis, San Diego State - Signed (4-years, $1.791M; $41,982 signing bonus)
247. Seattle (comp) - DE, Nick Reed, Oregon - Signed (4-years, $1.791M; $41,600 signing bonus)
248. Seattle (comp) - TE, Cameron Morrah, California
249. Cincinnati (comp) - DE, Clinton McDonald, Memphis
250. Jacksonville (comp) - RB, Rashad Jennings, Liberty
251. Chicago (comp) - WR, Derek Kinder, Pittsburgh - Signed (4-years, $1.787M; $37,666 signing bonus)
252. Cincinnati (comp) - WR, Freddie Brown, Utah
253. Jacksonville (comp) - WR, Tiquan Underwood, Rutgers
254. Arizona (comp) - G, Trevor Canfield, Cincinnati - Signed (3-years, $1.211M; $26,475 signing bonus)
255. Detroit (comp) - TE, Dan Gronkowski, Maryland
256. Kansas City (comp) - K, Ryan Succop, South Carolina - Signed (3-years, terms undisclosed)

The final kicker drafted in 2008, Brandon Coutu (#235 overall), received a $45,650 signing bonus. I'm thinking Succop definitely gets less than that $26,475 bonus for the #254 pick, who plays the more valuable guard position. So somewhere probably around $20,000 or so? That sounds about right. Speculate in the comment section and if you guess the bonus correctly, you win nothing.

So have at it. Is Ryan Succop rolling in a Camry or a Corolla after he gets his bonus?

Update by Primetime (9:27PM): I've learned that Succop's base salaries will be $310,000 (2009), $395,00 (2010) and $480,000 (2011). The deal hasn't been signed yet but that should be done by tomorrow. The signing bonus money would have to be about $24,000 to hit the $1.2 million number other South Carolina media outlets are citing.

Mocking the Draft: Make or Break Marvin Lewis

Kirkendall — Mon, 27 Apr 2009 22:00:14 -0000

As we transition ourselves out of the NFL Draft, waving goodbye to the annual obsessionists revealed convention, I asked Dan of Mocking the Draft to swing by to give us a few impressions of Cincinnati's draft. I was interested in the individual players. Such as moving Rey Maualuga to outside linebacker, or learning about Michael Johnson among other things. Like Daze and Confused, this is the part of the movie where we pan out with Tuesday's Gone playing in the background.

The Bengals were in position to take several players that fell to them, stealing them if you will, based on early projections. Who do you think was the best value pick by the Bengals?

Dan: "For me, it's getting Rey Maualuga. Coffman was a great value, but tight ends overall were dropping. Maualuga has his issues -- how well he can work in space, minor character concerns -- but he's a great player and can give the Bengals an identity defensively."

Who was the most questionable pick based on talent and on-field performances?

Dan: "It's hard to pinpoint on a Bengals pick in the first five rounds that was a bad choice. They really, really cleaned up. I also love the Fui Vakapuna pick in the seventh round. He's very fast for a fullback. But to answer the question, I guess I'd have to say Morgan Trent. He never did anything at Michigan that made him look like a potential pro."

As it stands, linebacker Rey Maualuga will begin his Cincinnati career behind Dhani Jones on the depth chart. However, based on what you're seen and scouted, could Maualuga make the transition to strong-side outside linebacker?

Dan: "Absolutely. He didn't have to rush the passer all that much at Southern California but shows the straight-line playing speed to do so. He's also really good at shedding blockers and can get upfield quickly."

What can you tell us about Memphis defensive tackle Clinton McDonald?

Dan: "Not a whole lot. I didn't see a lot of Memphis last season. I do know McDonald is a gap-shooting defensive tackle. He's not a big fattie who takes up blockers. He's the kind of guy who will get after the passer. He had seven sacks last year, which is pretty impressive for an interior lineman. He seems like a situational, nickel-down tackle."

Georgia Tech Defensive End Michael Johnson was rated as high as a mid-first round selection in some mock drafts. What about Johnson should we expect and will he be classified as a quarterback-rushing specialist?

Dan: "For now, I'd say he'll start his career as a pass-rush specialist. It's all about getting Johnson motivated to play hard every game. He had a lot of very good games in 2008 but just as many bad ones. There's just so much to work with in a player like Johnson. He's big, strong and athletic. In the hands of Marvin Lewis, that could be dangerous.

But that kind of leads me to the biggest problem with Cincinnati's draft. Can Lewis manage to motivate Johnson, Andre Smith, Chase Coffman and Maualuga every game? Johnson and Smith had questionable effort coming into the draft. Coffman has to be motivated to block better. Maualuga has to be made more disciplined.

So like I said during one the open threads at Mocking the Draft, this is the draft that will absolutely make or break Marvin Lewis. I think they should have maybe taken a better wide receiver than Freddie Brown, but that's a minor quibble."