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Around SBN: Spurs Power Through Bitter Dose Of Own Medicine

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Bucko

Jun 26, 2009 May 30, 2012 13 720

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Bucs Dugout Don't Worry About Heredia Just Yet

After last year's draft, like most folks around these parts I was brimming with excitement from the addition of 3 young pitchers with ace stuff to the Bucs' system.  Taillon had the most polish to go with his upside while Allie had perhaps even more potential, albeit in a more raw form.  But the player I found most intriguing was Luis Heredia - only sixteen years old and already throwing 93 mph.  He seemed to be a kind of hybrid of Taillon and Allie: a prospect with an impressive arsenal and makeup yet young enough to still be considered very raw. 

 

During Spring Training, reports from people like Charlie, WTM, and Tim Williams at Pirates Prospects among others only added to the excitement.  People were saying Taillon was looking like the guy we thought he would be. Allie was struggling with his command, but it wasn't anything to get to worked up about.  But Heredia, he was looking fierce.  His name seemed to be on everyone's mind.  There was a BUZZ.  My excitement level hit record highs.

 

So after I looked at his stat line today I couldn't help but be a little worried:

ERA 4.70, G 7, IP 15.1, H 10, R 8, ER 8, HR 0, BB 14, K 16, WHIP 1.56, BB/9 8.2, K/9 9.4, K/BB 1.14

 

I was puzzled.  I liked the strikeouts.  Didn't like the walks so much.  What was going on?  Heredia was not supposed to be just good, he was supposed to be awesome.  I had even criticized Charlie for having the nerve to rank Allie and his poor command directly behind Heredia and his super makeup and stuff.  Why wasn't he crushing the competition?

 

Today, I found myself checking out the minor league numbers for Braves phenom Julio Teheran.  He's tearing up AAA and still only 20 years old.  I wondered what his stat line looked like in Rookie ball.

ERA 6.60, G 6, IP 15, H 18, R 12, ER 11, HR 2, BB 4, K 17, WHIP 1.46, BB/9 2.4, K/9 10.2, K/BB 4.25

 

Overall, their lines are very, very similar.  Teheran had a better K/BB rate, but gave up more hits.

It's a small sample size, but I decided that it was a little too early for me to be getting all worked up about the results.  Both pitchers were making their Stateside debuts and getting their first real tastes of professional baseball.  Now I'm not crazy enough to predict that Heredia's career with follow the same path as Teheran's, but I'm also not going to write him off as a bust because he has an ERA over 4 and has been having control problems.  He's only sixteen and he has a long way to go.  Just like Teheran and Taillon and Allie, he's going to hit some speed bumps and struggle from time to time.  But it will take more than an handful of innings in Rookie ball to keep me from being excited about the kind of pitcher this kid could turn out to be.

12 comments  | 

Football is officially back on, but what will it mean for the Pirates?

As if the next week wasn't already crucial for Pittsburgh baseball, the end of the labor dispute could add a new wrinkle for the Bucs' newly revitalized fanbase. If the Pirates have a poor showing over the next 7 games will the fans lose interest and start talking Stillers once more?

I expect the hue and cry about the need to make a move is about to get even louder over the next few days.

10 months ago 04f_tiny Bucko 2 comments

Bucs Dugout Nathan Adcock Update?

I was snooping around on Royals Review, trying to see whether the KC blogger community saw him making the team or not.  I didn't really find anything concrete, although they seem to like him (they love his name, by the way).

Here are his stats so far this spring:

 

9 IP, 7H, 0 R, 0 ER, 0 HR, 2 BB, 3 K, .226 AVG, 1.33 GO/AO

 

He seems to be holding his own, but it doesn't seem that he's a lock to make the team out of spring training let alone finish the season with the Royals.  Although it's not a big deal, I would like to see him end up back with in the Bucs organization.

Has anyone heard any buzz about Adcock lately?

 









47 comments  | 

Bucs Dugout Rudy Owens: A Look Into the Future

I have become very intrigued by all of the talk surrounding Rudy Owens over the last few months.  We've been hearing conflicting reports of his stuff and his potential for a while now.  Some think he's a fringy Number 2 starter, some see him as a Number 5 innings eater.  Some of the folks around here would not hesitate to include him in a package for the Garzas or Uptons of the world, while others see him as one of the brightest jewels of the Neal Huntington's ever-increasing prospect hoard.  So what does the collective mind of Bucs Dugout think?  I've selected a group of pitchers who might represent the future of Rudy Owens.  Try not to think of Rudy having exactly the same stuff as these other pitchers, but rather think of him having a similar career trajectory as these guys.  I've got the poll closing on Saturday night, feel free to leave some more comparisons, my list is by no means exhaustive.


Poll
Who will Rudy Owens be like?
Tom Glavine - Hall of Famer
8 votes
Fernando Valenzuela - Win ROY and Cy Young in the same season
0 votes
Cliff Lee - Solid at first, spectacular later
16 votes
Mark Buehrle - Who needs "stuff," winners win
76 votes
Jake Westbrook - Some success, nothing too amazing
88 votes
Paul Maholm - Just a guy
42 votes
Zach Duke - Dazzle at first, average to crappy later
3 votes
Jeremy Sowers - Won't stick
4 votes
John Van Benschoten - Bad
3 votes

240 votes | Poll has closed

19 comments  | 

As it says in the link, he's only made 18 starts in the past two seasons and only managed to pitch 198 innings over the last three seasons.
Could he be someone the the FO targets this offseason? How much do you think he'd cost, and would he be worth the (rather significant) risk?

over 1 year ago 04f_tiny Bucko 0 comments

He's a two-way star, as he also has a commitment to play quarterback at Nebraska. Also sounds like he hasn't been pegged as either a hitter or a pitcher yet. Here's a video of Bubba at the plate.

over 1 year ago 04f_tiny Bucko 2 comments

Bucs Dugout Neal Huntington: Crazy Like A Fox?

During the Winter Caravan this past January, I asked Neal Huntington about his philosophy regarding the draft, specifically whether they would be looking to draft someone like Tony Sanchez or someone like Pedro Alvarez.  I didn't articulate it very well at the time, but what I really wanted to know was whether they would have taken someone like Pedro and people like Zack Von Rosenberg, Colton Cain, and Trent Stevenson if a superior talent were available at the top of the draft.

The Pirates have spent more money in the draft than anyone else the past two seasons, and are looking at spending $11 million just to sign their first two picks.  A lot of people who frequent this site have asked why the Bucs just don't break the bank and spend $15 - $20 million on the draft every year.  The very reasonable and probably correct answer has been that if the Royals and Pirates start spending that kind of money on the draft, sooner or later the Yankees and Red Sox will watch them reaping the benefits and then it will be only a matter of time before the big money teams are throwing their money around in both free agency and the draft, negating the Pirates advantage of buying cheap on draft day.

But in reading the chatter here and elsewhere, it really sounds like this draft system is dead as soon as the current collective bargaining agreement runs out.  NH basically said when answering my question that the Pirates love this system of drafting. He said that if the system changes of course they will abide by the rules, but as for now they plan on exploiting it to the fullest extent.

At the risk of sounding crazy, what are the chances that NH and FC are essentially saying "Screw it" and are just going to open the purse strings and blow up the record for spending in the draft?  If they believe they have an advantage, and the window on that advantage is closing, what's to stop them from milking it for everything it is worth?

97 comments  |  1 recs | 

Bucs Dugout Bucs v Brewers Overflow thread 2



Keep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it goingKeep it going

75 comments  | 

This is from a Yankees Blog, and it relies heavily on info from Forbes, so perhaps it should be taken with a grain of salt, or two. Thoughts?

about 2 years ago 04f_tiny Bucko 2 comments

I don't know what's scarier: that this kind of aggressive move doesn't have a strong track record of success or that Dusty Baker does have a strong track record for ruining young arms?

If nothing else, this demonstrates for me just how disparate the strategies of the Reds and Bucs really are.

about 2 years ago 04f_tiny Bucko 1 comment

Bucs Dugout Open Letter to the 2010 PBC


Dear Pittsburgh Pirates,

My old man likes to tell this story about my first baseball game.  Picture the scene: A youngish father leading his wide-eyed three-year-old son into that glorious erstwhile edifice know as Three Rivers Stadium.  The child is led to his seat, and is mesmerized by what unfolds in front of him.  It lasts nine innings.  No sleeping, no crying, no seven trips to the restroom.  More important things are happening in the child's world.  Baseball is happening.  Then the game ends, and the fireworks begin, and the father must bodily remove the screaming child from the stadium as quickly as possible.... Three years old, and without knowing it, the child's life will never be the same.  Three years old, his fate has been sealed.

So what do you, the 2010 Pittsburgh Ball Club have to do with that momentous night?  Very little. Bob Nutting, you were earning your degree.  Neal Huntington, you were fighting acne and counting the days till you could finally drive.  Andrew McCutchen, your mighty presence was still waiting to grace this plane of existence.  The only real connection you have with that team and that time is that you wear black hats emblazoned with a yellow "P".

Baseball has been my obsession for as long as I can remember.  I loved playing it.  I love listening to it.  I love talking about it.  And I love spending a summer's evening sipping a beer watching professionals ply their trade for my viewing pleasure.  And you, PBC, have been my main obsession for nearly all that time.  The Dark Ages that were the late 80s, I was there. (I didn't know any better.)  The Killer B's of the early 90's, I was there.  Somewhere in my parents attic, there is an autographed picture of Sid Bream. The same Sid Bream that played a solid 1B, and who inexplicably became my favorite player when I was 6.  Yes, the same Sid Bream who ripped my heart of my chest, threw it on the floor and ground it under his heel on October 14, 1992.

Okay, so maybe after my family moved to northeast Ohio, I wandered a bit in my allegiance.  Maybe I succumbed to the allure of Carlos Baerga, Jim Thome, Manny Ramirez, Charles Nagy, and Omar Vizquel.  But let's not make this about assigning blame.  Let's let bygones be bygones.  I'm here now, and that's all that matters.

I convinced my dad to buy a Ten Game Plan last year.  We got most of our games after the Trades.  We had a great time.  Sure, we'd have loved to have won a couple more games, but all things considered, it was a pretty damn fine way to spend a handful of late-summer evenings.  One in particular, stands out - September 25.

You might remember it.  Jeff Karstens started.  Only my dad and I could go that night,( the rest of the family couldn't make it) and we spent the hour drive to the park talking about how bad you were going to lose. We had the best seats we'd had all season: ten, twelve rows up on the first base line right on the bag, but that was about the only thing we were looking forward to that night. But then something strange happened.  Karstens pitched well.  Then Donnie Veal came in, and we rolled our eyes and said "This is it. Midnight. Pumpkin time."  But then he pitched well.  Somehow, you managed to push a few runs across the plate.  Some other scrubs came in to pitch, but no matter how hard you tried to lose that game, you were foiled at every turn. Somehow, against all odds, even though Matt Capps pitched the ninth and nearly gave me a coronary, you won.  And it was great..  Just me and my old man, very much like a certain night almost three decades before.

So I know that this year probably won't be your year.  I know it could be a long summer.  But I don't care.  I'm still going to be here.  My dad, he upped the ante, bought a 20 game partial Season Ticket plan.  So I'll be there in my Pirates hat 2 rows behind Cutch in Centerfield.  And I'll be here for every game after that - in spirit if not in body.  I don't care about 17 years.  I don't care about Jason Bay.  I don't care about Miguel Sano, Aroldis Chapman, Bryce Harper, Scott Boras or Bob Nutting's purse strings.  I care about Andrew McCutchen, Pedro Alvarez, Andy LaRoche, Charlie Morton, Tony Sanchez and some guys that I haven't even heard of yet.  I care about the Future, not the Past.  And from where I'm sitting, the Future, for the first time in a long time, is looking bright.

Yours Truly,

A Lifelong Pirate Fan

 

P.S.  And if Garrett Jones feels like dropping the game-winning HR into my glove in the ninth, I'll be okay with that.

8 comments  |  1 recs | 

Bucs Dugout Grading Trades

I'm not trying to knock any of Neil the Hun's trades here, but as Jerry would say "What is the deal with all these instant trade grades??"  I know we all want to be excited about what's happening right now, and I am.  I truly believe this team is finally being set up to win in the future.  (I just wish someone could explain it to my dad.  The Old Man is killing me, smalls!)

But might'n it be true that ofttimes we get a bit carried away with the whole "BooYeah we fleeced those hosers!" or "What!?! Only four players for Bay. Oh well, his first half in '09 will probably only be comparable to Raul Ibanez's anyways, so no big loss."

I'm a big Tribe fan as well, and as I watch this dialogue develop, it reminds me a lot of what happened in '02 in Cleveland.  Indians fan have never forgiven Mark Shapiro for trading Robbie Alomar.  I mean, it was like a nuclear (or nukeyoolar, if you're from Texas) bomb went of in that town.  "It's O.K.!" They said.  "We got Alex Escobar, and he's going to make the Ken Griffey Jr. from Seattle look like the Ken Griffey Jr. from Cincinnati!!!"  Alomar forgot how to play baseball  immediately upon arriving in New York and Alex Escobar made it into the Guinness Book of World Records by injuring every part of the body a human is capable of injuring.  As I recall, the total productivity of the 8 players involved in that trade plus a nickel will get you a hot cup of Jack Squat!!!  I'm pretty sure Alomar and Escobar are currently living in a van, down by the river...

A couple of months later, Shapiro shipped the Dominican Buddha Bartolo Colon to Omar Minaya's Expos for Brandon Phillips (YYYYYYEEEEESSSSSSS!!! BOO YEAH!!!) and Lee Stevens and a couple of guys named Clifton Lee and Grady Sizemore.  (Minaya later confessed he made the trade based on some advice he got from a sportswriter from New York. ( "If this works out as well as you say, I'll get you that job in the FO no problem!")  Phillips was the guy who They said needed watching.  Cliff Lee wasn't even considered that much of a steal until last season, which is impressive considering he won 46 games from '04-'06.  He was good enough to get the contract he has now, but Grady was considered the jewel of that trade up until Cliff Lee suddenly decided to stop allowing runs.

So alls I'm saying is, let's be excited, but not get carried away with who "won" or "lost" on the day the trade is made.  That just sounds way too close to Mel Kiper Jr. saying Reggie Bush-is-a-sure-fire Hall-of-Famer nonsense. Let's wait to grade til a little bit further down the road, when we can actually see , definitively, what we've got.  It's cool that the Hun managed to trade Freddy for the Jints #3 prospect according to BA, but let's not forget that this is the same publication that said that Bud Smith was a better prospect than Albert Pujols...

14 comments  |  1 recs | 

Bucs Dugout Cubs and Zach Duke

I saw this Gordon Edes note today on YahooSports!

With the Cubs’ only All-Star, Ted Lilly(notes), having shoulder trouble that will put him out of action indefinitely – worst-case scenario is that he has a torn biceps – expect the Cubs to be one of the teams making a push for Pirates left-hander Zach Duke(notes), who is very available. The Cubs also could have interest in shortstop Jack Wilson(notes).

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34 comments  |