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dougdirt

Mar 19, 2008 Feb 11, 2012 71 2286

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Minor League Ball 2012 Farm System Rankings based on John's individual grades

I created this last year and it was really fun. I posted this last night on my website (http://www.redsminorleagues.com) and thought I would re-post it here again this season.

These rankings are not indicative of John’s actual farm system rankings, which he is currently working on and will soon be found on his website. These are based on a system, as described below.

I went through each system that John graded and took down the grade for both hitters and pitchers. Why did I do that? Well, hitters and pitchers have different values. The value’s that I used were the ones first identified by Victor Wang in an article at The Hardball Times. The guys at Beyond The Box Score took that and made it into a monetary value. Here is what the average prospect was worth who fell in these ranges:

Top 10 hitting prospects $32.5M
Top 11-25 hitters $22.3
Top 26-50 hitters $20.8
Top 51-75 hitters $12.6
Top 76-100 hitters $11.1
Top 10 pitching prospects $13.5
Top 11-25 pitchers $14.2
Top 26-50 pitchers $14.2
Top 51-75 pitchers $10.8
Top 76-100 pitchers $8.7
Grade B pitchers (as graded by Sickels) $6.5
Grade B hitters $4.9
Grade C pitchers 22 or younger $1.9
Grade C pitchers 23 or older $1.3
Grade C hitters 22 or younger $0.62
Grade C hitters 23 or older $0.45

Now I did have to make some adjustments. As we can see, Pitching prospects in the 11-50 range tend to be more valuable than those in the Top 10. Since that doesn’t actually make much sense, I made every pitcher graded as a B+ or better worth the same "average" value of 14.2M.


Team A A- B+ B B- C+
H Value 32.5 22.3 20.8 12.6 4.9 0.88
P Value 14.2 14.2 14.2 9.8 6.5 2.6

For the C+ guys I had to change a little. I didn’t go through the 292 players who were graded C+ to find the age. So what I did was take the average C grade (split the difference between the two grades). That made 1.6 for pitchers and 0.54 for hitters.I used the weighting for the B grade prospects to wind up with the C+ being worth the same for a C as the B+ was for the B grades. Now that we had the value for each type of prospect, I just ran the numbers for the different teams. One thing to note, I didn’t include the grade C prospects because not all of the C prospects made each list, so the data was left out because it was incomplete. Here are the results:

Sickelsfarmsystems1_medium

(If you are going to repost this somewhere else, please give credit)

Here is a graphical breakdown of the values for each team with hitters/pitchers values:

Sickelsfarmsystems2_medium

(If you are going to repost this somewhere, please give credit)

I think that the numbers are correct, but if you see any inaccuracies, please let me know and I will correct them later this evening (I am about to head to bed for the day).

With all systems, there are some flaws in it. But, it is a fun exercise to go through and it is at least based somewhat in reality and avoids bias and opinions (aside from John's of course, which is where the entire system is based around).



81 comments  |  19 recs | 

Minor League Ball Devin Mesoraco vs. Yasmani Grandal



While John is away, he asked if I would be interested in writing up a piece comparing the Cincinnati Reds 2007 first round draft pick Devin Mesoraco to the Cincinnati Reds 2010 first round draft pick Yasmani Grandal. If you are unaware of who I am, I run and operate RedsMinorLeagues.com and have since 2005. Let me preface this by saying that I have never seen Yasmani Grandal play live, so everything is either second hand information or something I picked up while watching video online, while I have seen Devin Mesoraco play live over 40 times in the past year.

Poll
Which Reds catcher do you favor?
Devin Mesoraco
571 votes
Yasmani Grandal
306 votes

877 votes | Poll has closed

Continue reading this post »

22 comments  | 

Minor League Ball John Sickels Farm System Rankings

John Sickels is now done with all of his rankings.I have updated the values through his most recent "Important Grade Changes" post, as well as included the prospects from the Cubs/Rays trade.

How I went about creating the data

I went through each system that John graded and took down the grade for both hitters and pitchers. Why did I do that? Well, hitters and pitchers have different values. The value’s that I used were the ones first identified by Victor Wang in an article at The Hardball Times. The guys at Beyond The Box Score took that and made it into a monetary value. Here is what the average prospect was worth who fell in these ranges:

Top 10 hitting prospects $32.5M
Top 11-25 hitters $22.3
Top 26-50 hitters $20.8
Top 51-75 hitters $12.6
Top 76-100 hitters $11.1
Top 10 pitching prospects $13.5
Top 11-25 pitchers $14.2
Top 26-50 pitchers $14.2
Top 51-75 pitchers $10.8
Top 76-100 pitchers $8.7
Grade B pitchers (as graded by Sickels) $6.5
Grade B hitters $4.9
Grade C pitchers 22 or younger $1.9
Grade C pitchers 23 or older $1.3
Grade C hitters 22 or younger $0.62
Grade C hitters 23 or older $0.45

Now I did have to make some adjustments. As we can see, Pitching prospects in the 11-50 range tend to be more valuable than those in the Top 10. Since that doesn’t actually make much sense, I made every pitcher graded as a B+ or better worth the same "average" value of 14.2M.

Team A A- B+ B B- C+
H Value 32.5 22.3 20.8 12.6 4.9 0.88
P Value 14.2 14.2 14.2 9.8 6.5 2.6

 

For the C+ guys I had to change a little. I didn’t go through the 268 players who were graded C+ to find the age. So what I did was take the average C grade (split the difference between the two grades). That made 1.6 for pitchers and 0.54 for hitters.I used the weighting for the B grade prospects to wind up with the C+ being worth the same for a C as the B+ was for the B grades. Now that we had the value for each type of prospect, I just ran the numbers for the different teams. One thing to note, I didn’t include the grade C prospects because not all of the C prospects made each list, so the data was left out because it was incomplete.

Here are the results:

Sickelsfarmrankings4_medium


Here is a representation of how each team’s overall value broke down by Pitchers and Hitters value:

Sickelsfarmrankings23_medium

Does this align with your personal farm system rankings? Discuss.

77 comments  |  19 recs | 

Minor League Ball What's with the Wilson Ramos love?

With all of the Cliff Lee trade talk and the Twins being the 'front runners' for the acquisition, I continue to hear Wilson Ramos brought up as the center piece to the deal. How on Earth is a catcher with terrible plate discipline who is hitting .204/.240/.313 the center piece of a trade for the team that is considered the 'front runner'? Ramos has never had a good season offensively in the minors. He hasn't been bad in the past, but he also has never OPS'd .800 at any level either. What am I missing here? I just can't grasp how this guy is a good to very good prospect at this point. He is a little young for his level, but he is completely overmatched by AAA pitchers.

51 comments  |  1 recs | 

Red Reporter Mike Leake and his workload

Baseball tends to have a rule, the Verducci Rule as some call it, that a young pitcher doesn't exceed 30 innings pitched in a season over his previous career high. Mike Leake threw 142 innings last season for Arizona State, then took 5 months off before going to the AFL, so I can't really add those innings in like I have seen some others do. That ideally would put Leake on pace for 170 innings or so before you would like to 'shut it down' if you abide by the +30 rule.

This all got me thinking though, as Mike Leake isn't your typical 'young pitcher'. He is averaging less than 15 pitches per inning, routinely getting through 6 innings in 90 or fewer pitches. So I decided to look at all pitchers with 1 inning in either direction of Leake (between 59-61 IP this season) and how many pitches they would throw if they kept their current pace so far and threw 200 innings this season.

After the jump is the list, sorted by most pitches on pace to throw for 200 innings:

Continue reading this post »

30 comments  |  1 recs | 

Minor League Ball Neftali Soto to catch this season

The Reds have decided to let Neftali Soto catch during the season some, getting 2 starts a week behind the plate. He first caught last fall in instructs and the Reds liked what they saw. Could be pretty interesting if he can make the full transition at some point. For now he will be 'backing up' Devin Mesoraco in High A, but I don't think Mesoraco hangs around there for too long and its going to be interesting to see how much Soto catches once Mesoraco is gone.

http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2010/04/02/while-were-waiting-soto-to-catch/

1 comment  | 

Beyond the Box Score Need Perl script help to get Minors data


I am working on a project currently and I am really hoping someone out there can help me out. I have a working Perl script for MLB data as well as AAA and the Southern League in AA. They use the same format as the Majors do, so it was easy for me to manipulate to get the data even though I know next to nothing about Perl, I was easily able to figure out how to make that switch.  The problem is that I can't figure out how to get the script to work for the Eastern League in AA and the rest of the minors.

The Majors/AAA/Southern League use the format of Game-PBP-Batters/Pitchers-playerfile.xml

The rest of the minors use the format of Game-Inning-Inning_X.xml

The best I can get my Perl script is to create the game folders, download the box score and player list and create an 'innings' folder, but I can't get it to download the Inning_X.xml files. I tried to email Jeff Sackmann who runs MinorLeagueSplits.com and haven't gotten a response yet so I am now reaching out to you guys and hoping someone can help me out as I have spent about 14 hours of the last 2 days trying to tweak little things with my file to try and make it work and I just haven't had any success beyond what it listed to start this paragraph and that really doesn't help me much. Appreciate you taking the time to read it.

24 comments  | 

Minor League Ball John's Farm System Rankings

John is now done with all of his rankings. I know he said he had a few changes to make still, so this could change ever so slightly, though I doubt it makes much of an impact overall.

I went through each system that John graded and took down the grade for both hitters and pitchers. Why did I do that? Well, hitters and pitchers have different values. The value's that I used were the ones first identified by Victor Wang in an article at The Hardball Times. The guys at Beyond The Box Score took that and made it into a monetary value. Here is what the average prospect was worth who fell in these ranges:

Top 10 hitting prospects $32.5M
Top 11-25 hitters $22.3
Top 26-50 hitters $20.8
Top 51-75 hitters $12.6
Top 76-100 hitters $11.1
Top 10 pitching prospects $13.5
Top 11-25 pitchers $14.2
Top 26-50 pitchers $14.2
Top 51-75 pitchers $10.8
Top 76-100 pitchers $8.7
Grade B pitchers (as graded by Sickels)
$6.5
Grade B hitters $4.9
Grade C pitchers 22 or younger $1.9
Grade C pitchers 23 or older $1.3
Grade C hitters 22 or younger $0.62
Grade C hitters 23 or older $0.45

 

Now I did have to make some adjustments. As we can see, Pitching prospects in the 11-50 range tend to be more valuable than those in the Top 10. To counteract that sense ideally, it shouldn't be that way, I made each pitching prospect in the Top 61 (B+ or better grade) worth 14.2M. Here is the value I gave each grade - split for pitchers and hitters:

 

Team A A- B+ B B- C+
H Value 32.5 22.3 20.8 12.6 4.9 0.88
P Value 14.2 14.2 14.2 9.8 6.5 2.6

 

For the C+ guys I had to change a little. I didn't go through the 268 players who were graded C+ to find the age. So what I did was take the average C grade (split the difference between the two grades). That made 1.6 for pitchers and 0.54 for hitters.I used the weighting for the B grade prospects to wind up with the C+ being worth the same for a C as the B+ was for the B grades. Now that we had the value for each type of prospect, I just ran the numbers for the different teams. One thing to note, I didn't include the grade C prospects because not all of the C prospects made each list, so the data was left out because it was incomplete. Here are the results(updated to include the grade changes John has posted as of 1:30 on Monday):

 

    Hitters Pitchers  
  Team A A- B+ B B- C+ A A- B+ B B- C+ Value
1 Indians 1 0 1 1 1 3 0 0 0 3 3 11 150.94
2 Athletics 0 1 2 1 5 1 0 0 0 0 2 10 140.88
3 Braves 1 0 1 0 1 3 0 0 0 4 2 8 133.84
4 Rays 1 0 0 0 2 4 0 2 1 1 3 6 133.32
5 Rangers 0 1 0 0 1 5 1 1 1 2 2 6 122.40
6 Cubs 0 0 2 2 2 3 0 0 0 2 1 6 120.94
7 Angels 0 0 2 0 3 3 0 0 0 2 4 6 120.14
8 Brewers 0 0 2 1 2 6 0 0 0 1 4 5 118.08
9 Red Sox 0 0 1 2 3 7 0 0 1 1 2 5 116.86
10 Giants 1 0 0 1 3 3 0 1 0 1 3 4 116.34
11 Padres 0 0 1 3 2 7 0 0 1 1 0 6 114.16
12 Royals 0 0 0 2 2 5 0 0 1 3 2 5 109.00
13 Mets 0 0 2 1 1 3 0 0 1 1 2 2 103.94
14 Reds 0 0 2 1 1 4 0 1 0 1 1 3 100.92
15 Pirates 1 0 0 2 0 3 0 0 0 0 3 8 100.64
16 Dodgers 0 0 1 0 2 3 0 0 1 3 2 4 100.24
17 Tigers 0 0 0 3 1 3 0 0 2 1 1 3 97.84
18 Orioles 0 0 0 1 2 1 1 0 1 2 1 6 93.38
19 Blue Jays 0 0 1 1 1 5 0 0 2 0 1 5 90.60
20 Yankees 1 0 0 1 1 6 0 0 0 0 3 4 85.18
21 Nationals 0 0 1 1 2 5 1 0 1 0 0 3 83.80
22 Rockies 0 0 0 0 2 5 0 0 3 0 3 2 81.50
23 Twins 0 0 1 1 1 5 0 0 0 0 3 7 80.40
24 Astros 0 0 1 1 0 3 0 0 1 0 3 4 80.14
25 Marlins 0 1 1 1 0 5 0 0 0 2 0 0 79.70
26 Mariners 0 1 0 1 4 5 0 0 0 0 1 3 73.20
27 Phillies 0 0 1 0 0 6 0 0 0 0 3 5 58.58
28 White Sox 0 0 0 2 1 6 0 0 1 0 0 3 57.38
29 Cardinals 0 0 0 0 3 4 0 0 0 1 3 1 50.12
30 Dbacks 0 0 0 0 5 5 0 0 0 0 2 1 44.50

Totals 6 4 23 30 54 127 3 5 18 32 60 142  

66 comments  |  19 recs | 

Red Reporter Reds offensive ranks vs NL in 2009 by Position

So I am getting pretty stoked on the work that Kevin Dame is doing over at The Hardball Times in his "Visual Baseball" series where he interprets Baseball Data with graphics. In his most recent article he represented the 2010 Mariners hitters vs the rest of the leagues starters in OPS. I liked the idea and how it was represented. I tweaked a few things though and decided to just use the position for each team and ranked them by OPS+ since it adjusts for the park one plays in. Here are the results for our 2009 Reds:

Redsops_ranksinnl09_medium

You may want to click and open it in a larger window to get the full view. The one thing that surprised me was just how well our right fielders performed in 2009. The next thing was second base. I give Brandon Phillips my share of crap around the internet because I feel fans overrate his bat dramatically because of his RBI numbers 'being so good'. With that said, for national leaguers he was quite good at the plate. He still is in the wrong spot in the lineup by far, but that one isn't on him at all.

What does it all mean? Well, looking at those rankings what spots do you think the Reds can improve upon in 2010? What about spots you see a decline at? Here are my thinkings, feel free to share yours:

Improvement Positions:

Center - Its going to be tough to be as bad in center next season. Even Willy Taveras playing there next year is likely to be much better than he was in 2009. Given that Stubbs is likely to see most of the time there, even the most pessimistic on Stubbs think he will hit better than Taveras did in 2009.

Third Base - Scott Rolen makes a lot of his value on the other side of the ball, but even at this point in his career he should very much be expected to provide better offense than what Edwin and Rosales brought to us in 2009.

Declining Positions:

First Base - Call me a pessimist if you will, but I don't expect Votto to replicate another .375 BABIP season in 2010. If he falls down even to a .325 BABIP he would have to have the same rate of strikeouts, walks, HBP, SF and SH while hitting 42 doubles and 35 HR to have a .979 OPS. I just don't expect that big of a jump in power for Votto. I think he can be around the .900 OPS range, but he isn't likely to sniff .950+ again this year.

The Rest

I expect just about every other position to be about where they were. I think Jay Bruce picks up the slack in 2010 and makes up for the guys who filled in for him very well in the season. We have the same catchers back and while Corky Miller and Craig Tatum did get some playing time I figure they wind up in roughly the same area overall.

Anyways, that is my opinion. What about you guys?

56 comments  |  2 recs | 

Minor League Ball ProjectProspect's Top Prospects in Graphic Form

ProjectProspect.com has now gone through and made a Top 15 for all positions and a Top 30 for Pitchers. What I did was assign points based on all of that. 2 points for a 15 vote and 30 for a 1 vote. For the pitchers I just went 30-1 in points for the 1-30 spots. I added up all the teams points, multiplied by 2 then divided by 10 to give a Font Size to put the team name in the graphic. The idea came off of the work that Kevin Dame is doing at TheHardballTimes.com and I thought it was a pretty cool way to represent certain things. Obviously this is a little rough because there are some stronger positions and some weaker ones (2B jumped out to me as one of the weaker spots), but still I think it gives a decent look at the farm systems in baseball, at least as far as the teams Top 10's go (Boston actually had 12 players listed, San Diego was 2nd with 9). Here is what the graphic wound up looking like:

Graphicpptopspects_medium

I plan to do something similar once John comes out with his Top 20s for each team, assigning point values for each grade, but that is a ways off still.

42 comments  |  1 recs | 

Over at FirstInning.com (where I also write at now - shameless plug) one of the writers talked with Chris Heisey last week when Carolina came through his town (Chattanooga). Anyways, go check it out, but here is my inclusion to the interview and may give a little insight into his season so far and why its been so good:

Q: Doug Gray, (one of the writers at FirstInning.com and the guy at RedsMinorLeagues.com) wanted to know, you’ve always been a patient hitter, this year you have taken it to another level. Where did that come from and is that the reason why you are hitting with more power because you are seeing your pitch, working deeper into the count?

A: Yeah, it’s all kind of a combination. I worked with our (roving) hitting instructor, Ronnie Ortegon and with Ryan Jackson our (Mudcats) hitting coach on just my timing. During spring training Ronnie kept telling me that my timing was late. You are not getting your foot down in time so finally he told me just to go way earlier than I thought I had to. Well it was probably with three or four days left in spring training that I started getting my foot down in time and all of a sudden I was just starting to see the off-speed pitches. My biggest problem with strike-outs for sure was right-handers, sliders away and because that I am seeing the ball better now I am able to lay off that pitch a lot more. The biggest thing is just my timing, getting my foot down in time to see the ball. Obviously when you see the ball you’ve got a better chance, hitting the ball and taking more pitches that are not strikes.

over 2 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

I talked with LHP Jeremy Horst this morning for about 20 minutes about baseball and some other stuff. Go give it a listen before he makes his start tonight in Sarasota.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 2 comments

Minor League Ball Ethan Martin Videos and semi scouting report

Ethanmartin01_medium

via minorleaguenotebook.com

I took in Ethan Martin's last start when he came through Dayton. I have some video up with a little bit of a scouting report Here.

He topped out at 95 a few different times. Inconsistent offspeed stuff, but flashed itself as very good.

There is also about 6 or 7 other videos of Martin ptiching over on my youtube page. Also videos of Devaris Gordon, Austin Gallagher and of course a ton of Reds videos.

 

7 comments  | 

Ethan Martin video from his last start (Thursday the 23rd). There are more videos of Ethan and some other guys from the Great Lakes Loons on the youtube page. I am still uploading some stuff also, I had over 40 videos to get up.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Breaking down Aaron Harang's 3 hit, 9K, 0BB shutout against the Pirates in an Easter Sunday special.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 2 comments

Another young Athletics prospect making his debut this week. Struggled at times much like Cahill did earlier in the week. Curveball and slider are extremely similar... different grip, same pitch?

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Brett Anderson made his debut Friday. Here is what it looks like through the Pitch F/X camera's. Struggled throwing most of his pitches for strikes and perhaps suggests his slider and curveball are the same pitch.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Highly touted prospect Rick Porcello made his debut for the Tigers today. He had his ups and downs and really struggled with his offspeed stuff.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Taking a look at Cahill's debut through Pitch F/X.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 1 comment

One of Oaklands top pitching prospects had an iffy debut against the Angels. Here is how it looked through the Pitch F/X camera.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 2 comments

Minor League Ball Interviewing Kevin Golstein

Monday at 3PM (EST) we will be interviewing Kevin Goldstein of Baseball Prospectus about top prospects here, you can listen live and we will also have the chat room open during the show. If there is time, we will take phone calls.

If you can't listen live it will be available online here.

By the way, if anyone isn't aware, John does an appearance every Tuesday at BTR for Rotowire.com. So listen to those if you haven't been, there is always some good stuff in the show between Jeff and John.

0 comments  | 

Minor League Ball Strasburg demands for the draft?

From MLBTraderumors

ESPN.com's Peter Gammons heard from some club officials that top amateur pitcher Stephen Strasburg and his agent, Scott Boras, could demand $50MM over six years if he's selected first overall by the Nationals in the June draft. If the Nationals pick Strasburg and seem unwilling to pay him as much as he wants, Boras could threaten to send the prospect to pitch in Japan for a year. If the Nats are scared off, the Mariners and Padres are next in line for Strasburg.

So how could an amateur player get away with these lofty demands? Strasburg has struck out 74 and walked only seven in the 34.1 innings he's pitched for San Diego State and scouts rave about his stuff.

What do you guys think?
I personally think that its crazy to pay him that kind of money.

73 comments  | 

Red Reporter Scary Reds comparison

Here are two career stat lines of two guys who are/were Reds.

Player A - .253/.291/.407

Player B - .249/.294/.394

Know who each guy is?

Player A is of course, Corey Patterson.

Player B is the guy who will be our cleanup hitter for the 2nd year in a row against Right Handed Pitching for his career, Brandon Phillips. Its kind of a swift kick in the junk to Reds fans that somehow this is still going to happen in the middle of our lineup.

25 comments  | 

Monday at 4:00 PM EST we will be talking AL East Prospects live over at Blog Talk Radio. The Red Sox are flat out stacked, but you guys already knew that. You can also chat live during the show. If there is time, we will also take calls at the end.

We will be spending a half hour talking with Michael Andrews of SoxProspects.com and really going in depth into the system.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Monday at 4:00 PM EST we will be talking AL East Prospects live over at Blog Talk Radio. The defending AL Champs are still quite stacked down on the farm. You can also chat live during the show. If there is time, we will also take calls at the end.

Topics scheduled for the show involving the Rays

David Price laying claim as the best pitching prospect in the game... but what he needs to improve.

Tim Beckham's rough start as a pro and where he needs to get.

Jeff Niemann making a run at the #5 spot in the rotation and why he will win it.

If time allows it we also want to talk about Matt Moore and Wade Davis.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Monday at 4:00 PM EST we will be talking AL East Prospects live over at Blog Talk Radio. The Orioles are flat out stacked, but you guys already knew that. You can also chat live during the show. If there is time, we will also take calls at the end.

Topics scheduled for the Orioles discussion include:

Matt Wieters being the best prospect in baseball.

Brian Matusz
perhaps being the best of the Orioles pitching prospects.

Chris Tillman being the other guy in that argument and why I am not completely sold on him yet.

Jake Arrieta and Billy Rowell may find their way into the talk as well.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Looking at Juan Carlos Sulbaran (2008 30th round draft pick by the Reds, but paid $450,000-$500,000 to sign) through Pitch F/X.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Could Paul Demny climb the prospect boards in 2009?

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Looking at why Trevor May could rocket up prospect rankings for the Phillies in 2009.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments

Blake Brewer could rise quickly up the prospect charts for the Marlins in 2009.

almost 3 years ago Headshot_tiny dougdirt 0 comments